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Hey there! We’re Play to Win and we just uploaded a gameplay video, playing our personal decks. BREYA vs THRASIOS/TYMNA vs KENRITH vs TEFERI check it out submitted by /u/dylan414 to r/CompetitiveEDH [link] [comments]
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Yes, this is basically a joke deck on the corona virus, but I also want to find a way to make it work.
Commander: [[Ephara, God of the Polis]]
No budget for the deck, but I’d prefer to keep individual cards below $20 each in most cases.
Currently wincons are Germ swarms, with a backup plan of [[Approach of the Second Sun]], or voltron in an emergency. I’m betting I need a few more anthems to keep my germs alive early.
Permanent flicker/blinks have been a little harder to find than creature, but I was hoping to avoid turning the equipment into creatures. Not totally excited for non-repeatable effects.
The card stealing can mostly be cut for better on theme cards, and copying cards can be reduced as needed too. Didn’t feel there were enough living weapons to produce enough germs.
(first of all sorry of i have some error in my spelling, inglish is not my best lenguage) soo after watching videos of mtg for years a moved to a city were i can finally play, i’m in a budget and want to build a equipment/tokens value deck, i’m thinking of going with alela or dalakos but i can’t decide witch one to use and don’t really know how to build the decks, if you have a list that i can see or some advice it would be great
What’s more difficult doomsday piles or keeping track of Niv’s triggers ?? Thanks to u/nslover for the new logo! We post videos every Saturday if you’re interested in subscribing. BEST 2 COLOR COMMANDER IN CEDH submitted by /u/dylan414 …
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A lot of people chuckle when I pull out my [[djeru, with eyes open]] deck. They make the usual jokes and are initially inclined towards poor threat assessment. Being able to tutor up planeswalkers with my commander has proven incredibly powerful, and t…
I want to be shuffled into my library. submitted by /u/Dadulka to r/magicTCG [link] [comments]
I’m writing this because in the wake of the Wrenn and Six’s dominance/banning and the buzz surrounding all the decks opened up by the ban, this deck has kind of managed to fly much farther under the radar than it should. After seeing Phil Gallagher play this deck, playing it myself and experimenting with it, I can say that Urza Echo is a pretty good deck that has the potential to supplant Bomberman as the primer Chalice Combo deck in Legacy.
4 Urza, Lord High Artificer
4 Emry, Lurker of the Loch
4 Karn the Great Creator
4 Narset, Parter of Veils
4 Echo of Eons
3 Lion’s Eye Diamond
4 Chalice of the Void
4 Mox Opal
4 Lotus Petal
4 Urza’s Bauble
4 Mishra’s Bauble
4 Seat of the Synod
2 Ancient Tomb
2 City of Traitors
1 Lion’s Eye Diamond
1 Mycosynth Lattice
1 Ensnaring Bridge
1 Wurmcoil Engine
1 Mystic Forge
1 Walking Ballista
1 Tormod’s Crypt
2 Defense Grid
2 Ratchet Bomb
2 Mystical Dispute
So what is this pile of cards and what is it trying to do?:
Urza Echo is an artifact based combo deck that uses fast mana and artifact synergies to do something utterly broken within the first 1-2 turns of the game. These plays can include any/all of Chalice of the Void on 1, playing a fast Urza or Karn, Emry milling Echo (ie drawing Timetwister), playing Echo with Narset out to Mind Twist the opponent, and using LED + Echo as if they were Black Lotus and Timetwister. This deck is well set up to do at least one of these things incredibly quickly and with a fair bit of redundancy and resiliency to countermagic and discard .
The Core of the main deck:
3 Lion’s Eye Diamond: This is the best card in the deck and the one that gives the deck it’s explosiveness. LED + Echo lets you just dump your hand and completely reload for free and gives you massive amounts of card advantage as you often do this before your opponent gets to play out their hand. Lion’s Eye Diamond also synergies really well with Karn by giving you the mana you need to quickly play anything you grab with Karn. Also LED does not need to tap in order to be sacrificed for mana; so if you think Black Lotus isn’t broken enough can tap it to Urza then sac it for a total of FOUR MANA.
4 Karn the Great Creator: The best win condition for any artifact based deck capable of generating loads of mana.
4 Urza, Lord High Artificer: Urza turns all your artifacts into Moxes, and gives you a huge Construct and a card advantage engine all for four mana. You essentially get to play Vintage instead of Legacy when he’s in play; he’s broken and one of the biggest draws towards this deck over Bomberman.
4 Narset, Parter of Veils: In addition to giving you card selection/advantage with her minus and shutting off cantrips with her passive, Narset is a combo piece in this deck; and one that happens to dig for the rest of the combo at that. If you cast Echo with Narset out, your opponent shuffles their entire hand and graveyard into their deck and draws ONE card. Or, if your opponent already drew a card on your turn for some reason (usually a previous Echo), they shuffle everything back in and draw ZERO cards. Either of these usually wins you the game on the spot and can be done on turns 1-3 pretty easily. She’s also a big reason to play this deck over Bomberman.
4 Chalice of the Void: If you’ve played Legacy before you are familiar with this card. You play it on one or two and laugh as 1/3 of your opponent’s deck no longer works. The fact that you are an incredibly fast combo deck that gets to play Chalice gives you a lot of resiliency as you can stretch your opponent’s Force of Wills really thin.
4 Emry, Lurker of the Loch: This was the addition that finally made this deck good. She’s really easy to play on turn 1, can rebuy devastating artifacts such as Chalice of the Void, can generate lots of card advantage by replaying baubles, can generate mana by replaying Lotus Petals, extra Mox Opals, or LEDs, and she occasionally just draws you Timetwister by milling Echo of Eons. Dreadhorde Arcanist is getting a lot of buzz right now and Emry is a much better Dreadhorde Arcanist.
4 Echo of Eons: The deck’s signature card; this deck is designed to get this thing to do the best Timetwister impression possible and abuse the power of such an effect. You’ve heard me mention the card’s synergies several times before: LED+Echo is comparable to Lotus+Timetwister, the addition of Narset makes this a game ending play, Emry can just randomly mill it. Not to mention that if you can hardcast Echo, it goes to your graveyard, allowing you to dump your new hand and then flashback Echo for another 7 cards all while just burying your opponent in card advantage. The ability to abuse LED without first resolving a four mana spell that this card provides is probably the biggest draw to this deck over Bomberman.
4 Mox Opal: Moxes are great; Moxes + Timetwister is just obscene. The price for this power is you need to have Metalcraft to enable it. This usually requires you to be careful of when you crack your Baubles or Lotus Petals.
4 Lotus Petal: More fast mana and Metalcraft enablers
7 Baubles: These enable Metalcraft, let you quickly draw through your deck, become Moxes with Urza out, and turn into a card advantage engine with Emry. Also the information about what your opponent has that they give you is quite useful.
1 Flex Slot: I’m playing Bauble #8 right now. Engineered Explosives and Welding Jar are other considerations for this slot
The caveats to the main deck’s flex slot are:
- The cards you put here need to be good ways to enable Mox Opal
- They shouldn’t be 1 drops or else they will conflict with Chalice of the Void
Karn Targets (In order of the frequency they are fetched up)-
1 Lion’s Eye Diamond: In addition to all the previously mentioned synergies, this is a pretty good way to guarantee that you can cast Lattice when you fetch it. Black Lotus makes getting the 6 mana needed to cast Lattice and get it through soft counters pathetically easy.
1 Mycosynth Lattice: This card’s synergy with Karn is well documented at this point. What I want to mention here is how powerful Lattice can be in this deck even when Karn isn’t in play. Lattice + Urza makes TONS of mana and Karnstructs large enough to one shot the opponent.
1 Ensnaring Bridge: The best way to lock down a board of creatures to give you time to combo off.
1 Wurmcoil Engine: If you know Karn will die before you can get Lattice off, this is just a huge threat that can beat some decks by itself that can be recurred with Emry
1 Mystic Forge: A powerful card advantage engine for four mana
1 Walking Ballista: An answer to any creature that’s annoying you that can be recurred with Emry (Thalia, Delver, Sanctum Prelate, the Elves! deck in general)
1 Tormod’s Crypt: Free graveyard hate that can be recurred with Emry
2 Ratchet Bomb: These are here to be boarded in to answer Chalice of the Void on zero. If your deck has more colorless sources in the mana base, I’d look at playing Engineered Explosives in this slot or trying a splash for Abrade now that Wrenn and Six is gone.
2 Defense Grid: These get boarded in against anything playing Force of Will/Negation
Other Sideboard cards-
2 Flusterstorm: 1 mana counterspell that you can cast through a Chalice on 1, usually boarded in against Griselbrand decks or similarly fast combo decks
2 Mystical Dispute: See above
Playing the deck:
The way I see it, the most common, difficult parts of playing the deck can be boiled down into a few categories: Mulliganing, Sequencing, Playing through Force of Will/Negation, and Sideboarding.
Mulliganing: The best advice I can give here outside of “practice”, is that this is a combo deck that is trying to do something powerful, quickly. This usually means one of these: Chalice of the Void on 1, playing a fast Urza or Karn, turn 1 Emry, turn 1 or 2 Narset, and/or dumping a hand of artifacts onto the table and casting Echo with LED. A hand that can do any of these things is usually a keep. If you do mulligan below 5 cards, you also do have the option of abusing to the London Mulligan to find a hand with LED and Echo to essentially unmulligan yourself.
Sequencing: This in general, refers to playing out your hand in such a way that minimizes the potential for blowouts. The most important forms of this are: knowing when to play City of Traitors, knowing when to crack Lotus Petal/Baubles playing around soft counters when you can, playing around Lightning Bolt or similar cards on a Karn, Narset, or Emry when you can, and playing around Wasteland when you can. Truth be told, this mostly contextual and comes down to experience with Legacy.
Playing through Force of Will/Negation: It’s no secret that the best way that the best tool fair blue decks have against you is Force of Will. This is a deck that is trying make a bunch of mana quickly and pour it into a powerful play or two on the first turns of the game; a free hard counter is a natural foil to this. Fortunately for you, your opponent will at most be on about 4-6 Forces in their 75. Compared to this your “must answer threats” total to about 16-24 depending on how effective/easy to kill Narset and Emry are in the matchup. This means that you beat Force by jamming threats in rapid succession while having mana open to blank your opponent’s soft counters. Eventually, your opponent will be out of Forces and you can easily resolve a threat through Daze/Spell Pierce with your abundance of mana.
Sideboarding: The secret here is to not sideboard too much. When your good draws are powerful by Vintage standards, it is most often on your opponents to react to what you are doing. The purpose of your sideboard beyond Karn is to give you countermeasures against opposing hate.
With that in mind, Defense Grid comes in against Force of Will decks, Ratchet Bomb comes in against anything putting Chalice of the Void on 0, and the counterspells come in against combo. Against Chalice decks, board out Chalices for Ratchet Bombs, Mystic Forge, Ballista. Against fair blue, Defense grids come in and you shave a Mishra’s Bauble and a Lotus Petal. Against Combo, you take out 2 Baubles, an Emry, and an Urza for the 4 counterspells. Against fair non-blue decks, no changes unless you see something that randomly wrecks you.
If you notice a lot of Null Rods and/or Collector Ouphes in your meta, you might want to change up the mana base to try to splash for Abrade or Shenanigans; you could also just try to do something broken before those cards come down. At the end of the day, little can beat turn 1 Narset, crack LED, Echo.
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Check out the latest issue of Lessons From the Fringe!!
In this episode, we look at some of the nuanced rules interactions to wrap your head around if you want to push Anje Falkenrath as far as she can possibly go. Points covered include:
- Breaking Necropotence by overcoming the designers’ intentions
- Winning in your End Step, Cleanup Step, or right over the top of another player trying to combo out
- Cleanup Sculpting without Gitrog
- Using both parts of the Madness ability to your advantage
- Real world examples
- and more!
As always, questions, comments, and criticism is welcome.
And before you ask, yes there is more to come on Yarok 😉
Check out the latest issue of Lessons From the Fringe!! As always, questions, comments, and criticism is welcome. And before you ask, yes there is more to come on Yarok 😉 submitted by /u/cobblepott to r/CompetitiveEDH [li…
Looking to pick up something like this to store multiple decks and maybe a playmat/dice (which I can also take with me for extended play sessions with friends at their places). The Superhive’s magnets I think was improved since the Prof reviewed them a while back. But I’m not sure if that thing can fit Satin Towers.
Ideally would like that Legion Blackfire Garage thing the Prof also reviewed, but last I checked that thing sold out super fast and have never been restocked since.
Anyone got similar alternatives they can suggest? I use Satin Towers and Boulders exclusively for my EDH decks, so at the very least it got to be able to accomodate the former
It may not be tier 1, and maybe a bit irritating to play against, but boy is Cauldron Familiar/Witch’s Oven a fun deck to play. Lots of variants out there, I’ve been on Rakdos on Arena B01. Mayhem Devil has been an all-star, as well as the Claim the Firstborn/Oven combo. However, I just tried out an Orzhov version – Cruel Celebrant is also the real deal, lots of life gain, especially with Teysa Karlov out. Corpse Knight, of course Midnight Reaper – lots of synergies. Anyone having success with either of these, and have an optimized list to share?
Priest of the Forgotten Gods is great with Chandra, Acolyte of Flames in Rakdos (saccing the tokens seems bonkers every turn), but otherwise seems not so strong unless you have a ton of sac fodder. Am I missing something?
Gutterbones is great on the play, not as good on the draw of course.
Orzhov Enforcer holds off much bigger creatures on the ground and afterlife is great for saccing value.
I’m on mobile right now, otherwise I’d share the lists I’ve tried (sorry). Playing Arena BO1 but interested in paper Standard FNM.
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[The Spike Feeders] A $25 Love Letter to Commander’s Quarters (part 1) | The Spike Feeders Commander Gameplay | S4E1
It’s been like 3 months since our season 3 finale! We spent the summer lounging by the water, filming and editing a ton, and hitting MagicFest Vegas. Hard.
We figured we’d kick things off with a love letter to our favourite Budget EDH content in the entire world – The Commander’s Quarters. Mitch’s decks are powerful, and it’s totally reasonable to just straight up buy one. They’re cheaper than preconstructed decks and are laser focused on their theme.
Jim: $25 The Scarab God.
This deck is Jim’s favourite Commanders Quarters deck of all time. It pumps out the zambies like nobody’s business, has a nice tight curve, and has a surprising amount of action on turn 1.
Eliot: $25 Nezahal Voltron
I have to admit, when I first saw Nezahal spoiled I looked at it as a control finisher. Voltron was the last thing on my mind. Mitch saw a way to get in for beats, draw a ton of cards, and repeatedly bounce non-seacreature permanents and tied all these elements together in a surprisingly oppressive decklist.
Bill’s obsessed with this deck. It’s synergistic, combos at the drop of a hat, and is totally capable of keeping the board entirely clear. It’s the only budget deck he’s actually willing to play without us bugging him.
Maddy: $25 Feather, the Redeemed
Maddy bought the Feather and the Yawgmoth decks to bring to Vegas and lent Yawgmoth to Bill for this episode. She was really excited to play Feather, and after playing against it I can definitely see why. This deck just straight up kills people. It mitigates the lack of card advantage in Boros by ensuring that you don’t go down a card when you cast a spell, and takes advantage of card advantage and filtering on cards like [[Samut’s Sprint]] and [[Expedite]] to keep the pedal to the metal.
As always, this section contains spoilers! Go watch the episode before you keep reading.
8:14: When you’re playing Voltron, especially one as aggressive as Feather, when you choose to attack the first player you’re usually committing to attacking them until they’re dead. Jim was definitely the biggest threat at the table when Maddy chose to attack him, but did she make the right choice?
12:26: Maddy acknowledges it a little later in the episode, but she should likely be casting any instant speed action after blockers are declared so she gives minimal information to her opponents.
16:41: Maddy could have attacked Eliot and taken him out, and Bill would have let it happen. Was this the right choice?
18:50 Eliot discards to hand size, but Nezahal has a Spellbook effect stapled to it! As a result, we have terminated Eliot’s contract and are currently looking at applicants to replace him. Not actually, but man Nezahal has a lot of text. I think at this point if you told me it taps for green I’d believe you.
22:03: Maddy discards Double Cleave. This one’s more expensive than some of the other double strike enablers in the deck but it is easier to cast. Later on this is relevant because she’s got 2 white mana up and needs a double strike spell to kill Eliot.
Would you have made any different decisions than the ones we made in the episode? Let me know in the comments below!
Our First Ever Double Up
We’re trying something a little different for this episode. We were able to get a ton of content filmed over the summer, and for some games we had time to shuffle up and play a second game with the same decks! The second game is going to get declassified next week, but if you want to watch the games back-to-back, head over to our Patreon! We’ll be doing a few double ups this season, so you don’t want to miss them.
Make sure you check out www.spikefeeders.com/shop to pick up Spike Feeders merchandise! Our white and gold foil playmats are totally sold out right now (they were really popular in Vegas), but we should have more in stock early next week.
Here’s the latest iteration of my take on Yarok.
State of the deck:
Big shake up!
Write-up rewrite in progress…
Apply stax to slow the table, then go infinite and win.
Yarok doubles up on punishing passives like Overburden and also accentuates parity breakers like Lotus Cobra and Amulet of Vigor . This forms a great backbone to support lines involving Root Maze or Orb of Dreams . Under such lines, all your lands effectively get doubled and we have ways to reconcile Overburden returning two lands to hand whenever a creature enters. Arboreal Grazer and Elvish Pioneer scale along with Overburden (with or without Yarok) to break parity along that line and add a tap clause for lands to further embellish Amulet of Vigor . Burgeoning helps maintain a faster pace than the table as well, given the unique texture of a ‘landless’ table.
With Yarok on the table Shrieking Drake + Cloud of Faeries yields infinite mana. With infinite mana, Shrieking Drake + Coiling Oracle or similar draws the deck and lets you win via Laboratory Maniac .
- With Yarok (UU): Cloud of Faeries + Coiling Oracle + Shrieking Drake , etc
- Without Yarok (UUB + draw): Spellseeker + Laboratory Maniac : Demonic Consultation
- Use Survival to put Cloud of Faeries + Dream Stalker + Coiling Oracle in the yard, reanimate Faeries and Stalker with Necromancy . Dream Stalker bounces Necromancy . Repeat for infinite mana, then switch to Stalker + Oracle.
The number of ‘incidental’ lines under Yarok that let you gain advantage is positively enormous. I’ll break those down soon… but they’re things like this:
- Grazer enters and creates 4 triggers. Let the two Overburden triggers resolve to return two lands, then let the two Arboreal Grazer triggers resolve to put them back into play. Each land will trigger Amulet of Vigor twice, so you’ll get 4 mana for a single Grazer etb.
- Dance of Many enters triggering twice and creates two copies of Risen Reef . All three Reefs see two elementals enter and each trigger is doubled so you get a total of 12 Risen Reef triggers for your investment.
- Cast Crop Rotation and grab a fetchland. Both Lotus Cobra and Tatyova, Benthic Druid double trigger for the fetch and the fetch target so your works out to 4 mana, 4 cards, and an untapped land at instant speed.
… on and on and on …
All these ‘combos’ are purely incidental, i.e., you’d never go looking for any of these card sequences, but they emerge along the way as you’re setting up the actual lines you want. All the extra cards and mana provide plenty of support to fight through opponent interaction, making it more likely for you to succeed where a more canonical, tighter-margined line would get otherwise disrupted.
I’d be interested in feedback of all kinds. Questions, critiques, suggestions, all thoughts welcome!
This resource is intended to explain the ideas behind winconless decks, when to cut wincons and some of the most basic “winconless” approaches.
First up, “Wincon” is short for “Win Condition”, but what counts as one?
The waters around this can be a little bit muddy. Some people say that the combo set up is the wincon, while some focus on the outlet.
In a deck like Breakfast Hulk; Hermit Druid, the Breakfast Combo, Laboratory Maniac, Hulk Death Trigger or even Ad Nauseam could all be described as “wincons” in different contexts.
When discussing “winconless”, it’s typically the piece that takes you from “comboing off” to “dead opponents” that is counted as a wincon. In Breakfast Hulk, that would be the Laboratory Maniac.
There is a spectrum of how useful outside its role as a win condition a given spell is.
Near the bottom would be a card like Exsanguinate. Killing players in a non-infinite way is very difficult, and it doesn’t really have utility outside killing people. When you aren’t winning with it, Laboratory Maniac is a Gray Ogre, which is a card often used as the butt of jokes about bad cards.
Up from there would be a card like Grapeshot. Doesn’t do much, but in a pinch can remove a truly problematic permanent. Slightly better is something like Blue Sun’s Zenith, which is a mediocre card draw spell, or Walking Ballista, which has a moderately useful board presence.
Winconless decks seek to win using cards closest to the “useful spell” end of this spectrum.
One of the first decks to go “winconless” was Tasigur. Beast Within and Reality Shift are both passable removal spells, and when looped infinitely with Tasigur, they let you destroy all of someone’s permanents and exile their library.
Some Green-based decks like Selvala and Momir went for Eternal Witness loops, repeatedly casting some standalone spells to win.
We see it in lots of other decks as well, perhaps most famously in Scepter Thrasios, where the “Twister Loop” was used to recur some spell to kill.
It comes down to card quality. If you have infinite mana and access to your whole library, who cares if your win is pieced together from 5 cards? But when you are trying to play the game and avoid losing, wouldn’t you prefer if you didn’t draw Aetherflux Reservoir?
The combos most friendly towards being made winconless are ones that involve infinite mana or draw, such as Scepter with an outlet in the CZ, Top + Future sight etc.
One of the most common culprits is Laboratory Maniac or Jace, Wielder of Mysteries in decks without Tainted Pact/Demonic Consultation. If you have to draw your entire deck to win with a card, chances are you can cobble together a win out of the cards you drew, rather than running a dedicated wincon. This, and other similar scenarios, are when to look for cutting wincons.
Not that all dedicated wincons should be cut, for example, storm decks can “manually” use Aetherflux Reservoir when not going infinite, or certain spells may allow you to win at instant speed, or through some disruption or hate piece. “Winconless” should be applied only to cards that do not enable wins that are otherwise unavailable.
Some examples of decks that commonly include unnecessary wincons, and could go winconless:
Laboratory Maniac or Jace, Wielder of Mysteries in Urza, Lord High Artificer
You are casting your whole deck for free. Look for Twister/Narsets Reversal loops, or Codex Shredder + scepter to mill.
Laboratory Maniac or Jace, Wielder of Mysteries in Chulane, Teller of Tales
Your various combos draw your deck, and typically have a way to start generating mana once you draw a given piece. You also have tons of ways of repeatedly using Eternal Witness, and often Finale of Devastation
A life loss spell in The Gitrog Monster
You make infinite mana and loop your whole deck. You can use Finale of Devastation, Assassin’s Trophy etc.
Storm Payoffs in Elsha/Kykar
These decks do Top+Future Sight style combos and draw the whole deck. It’s easy to net mana and go in to some loop
There are lots of tools available to winconless decks, and many of them are both recent quite affordable (with a couple exceptions). They fall in to a few different categories:
These are spells that will actually win you the game if cast infinite under the right scenarios:
- Swan Song for infinite 2/2 birds (requires haste or the ability to survive a turn cycle)
- Assassin’s Trophy to destroy all of your opponent’s permanents
- Winds of Rebuke to mill your opponents infinitely
- Extract to exile your opponents libraries
- Praetors Grasp to exile your opponents libraries
- Finale of Devastation to kill with infinite mana and some creatures
Note that Winds of Rebuke and Assassin’s Trophy may not be suitable for Twister loops as Timetwister will reset your progress.
These are spells that let you leverage infinite access to your deck by recurring spells (through draw or something like Urza/The First Sliver)
Multi-Buyback spells such as:
Timetwister, Memory’s Journey, Echo of Eons. Any spell that lets you put more than one card from your graveyard back in to your library to draw again. These will put both Payloads and single buyback spells back in to your library
Single Buyback Spells such as:
Regrowth, Noxious Revival, Eternal Witness, Codex Shredder. These let you buy back your multi-buyback spell of loop enabler, and will in turn be bought back by them.
Copy Artifact – Copying your Isochron Scepter with Dramatic Reversal and putting a payload under it
Narset’s Reversal – Either under Scepter or with Bonus Round, this spell lets you copy payload spells infinitely. It can also function as a single buyback spell by copying your multi buyback spell and returning it to your hand
The basic Twister Loop:
Requirements: Some way to infinitely cast spells that are in your library, either a combo of Infinite Mana + Draw, or infinite cascade, infinite urza activations or similar. Timetwister or an analogue, Regrowth or an analogue, Payload spell.
- Find your Payload spell
- Cast your Payload spell
- Find your Twister effect
- Cast your Twister effect (shuffling in your Regrowth and Payload effects)
- Find your Regrowth Effect
- Cast your Regrowth Effect, returning Twister
The basic dual scepter setup:
Requirements: Isochron Scepter + Dramatic Reversal making infinite mana. Access to your whole deck. Copy Artifact, Payload that can go under scepter (or payload that can’t + narset’s reversal).
- Cast Copy Artifact, copying Isochron Scepter, Imprinting Narset’s Reversal
- Cast your Payload Spell.
- Activate the Scepter with Narset’s Reversal, returning your Payload to your hand and copying it
- Let the Copy Resolve
- Activate the Scepter with Dramatic Reversal, untapping both Scepters
If you have a payload that goes under scepter, you can skip steps 2 and 4, and modify step 3 to cast the payload off of scepter.
Downsides of going Winconless
- Winconless combos often require more cards, so there can be increased risk of losing access to something important.
- Most winconless lines are not shortcuttable, which means you will have to execute an obnoxious combo if somebody asks you to
- Winconless combos can be more difficult to execute
If you have any suggestions or questions, please feel free to comment, I will probably turn this in to a nicer formatted and updated doc someday.
Many of my friends and family have been playing Magic during their school years, some as early as 1995, but go on long breaks afterwards. Every few years we had a phase where every few months or weeks we would play 60 card decks against each other, either 1v1 or multiplayer, but we didn’t play a format so the power levels were wastly different, and the games weren’t fun for many of us. Imagine the one guy who didn’t upgrade his deck in the last 20 years against someone with the thopter sword combo.
Years later, we have a thriving playgroup, having magic nights multiple times per week and having much more fun. What happened?
Well, first commander happened but it only caught the ones who were both competitive and had a large card pool. The others reluctantly tried it but never had enough of the right cards to have any chance of winning. Imagine a reanimator deck full of reanimation spells and fatties but the player didn’t have any spells to put them into the graveyard.
It was so stressfull going through the period of RL card spikes when you wondered whether you could get that dual land you need for that deck before it got unobtainable. Or the wasted money when ordering cards for a new deck only to find that the deck was boring for the player and the cards never get used. Or having to limit yourself to a number of decks equal to your number of Sol Rings or whatever key card the decks needed. Or all the time spent looking at finance posts trying to find the best time to get that card. Or having to buy certain cards while they were still cheap just on the chance that you need them some day when you can’t afford them anymore.
The fun started when we began proxying. And I don’t mean one or two cards, I mean full on proxying, like decks with 100% proxies, including proxy basic lands included for a matching style. And I have to tell you, it has been liberating!
In our final push of proxying, even the ones who have cards like duals and fetches actually took them out of their decks and replaced them with proxies and it has been great! I actually like the Masters Edition black bordered duals more than the faded white bordered revised ones. There are beautiful alternate artworks that I would actually buy if there are real, like from [[Emrakul, the Promised End]].
But it’s not like we never buy cards. Sometimes the original is really nice and affordable. Then I buy a large amount of a card that are good in many decks, like [[Compost]], and give out a few. Or I really want to have that judge foil old border [[Sword of Feast and Famine]]. Or that From the Vault Set. But it doesn’t have to be when I build the deck but at a later point when there is a good offer on Card Market. Or when the card rotated out of standard but I don’t have to wait 2 years before you can use the card in a deck.
And it is so much less stressfull than carrying around hundreds of €s around every time. We play in the garden. We play when there is a strong wind and cards fly around. We play near the camp fire. We put our drinks on the table near our cards. We try new decks and new ideas. We have fun with crazy expensive cards like [[Eureka]]. And I suggest you do to!
Recently, in this subreddit and in other outlets, there’s been talk of a breaking away from the Rules Committee. r/CompetitiveEDH is, despite the long discussions in light of the recent bans, not going to endorse the discussed separate rulesets nor banlists.
As to why, it is time for a reminder:
The community here has, from the beginning, existed as a safe haven for people looking to explore the Commander format, as-is, to its extremes. Consequently, it also exists to explore what Commander can offer to ones with a mindset of (within the rules of the game) aiming to achieve victory as a primary objective.
The social contract of cEDH players is predicated first and foremost on the above: the mutual fun of the pod is emergent from the thrill of chasing that objective in both tight technical gameplay and ingenuity in deck construction. Secondly, it is built on upholding and adhering to the first and foremost of our rules: being excellent to each other. This community still exists today as the balance and harmony between these two philosophies.
We are not looking to create new formats or banlists. We are Commander players at heart, and what we’ve been aiming to achieve is not different than the many others that play at other power levels. We’re seeking to express ourselves through deckbuilding (with rigor and power as the driving entities rather than other goals) and create compelling, social gameplay that embodies how we enjoy Magic. The mindset and purpose of the current community was created with these gameplay- and socially-oriented goals in mind. The vastness of the card pool coupled with the dynamisms of multiplayer create an unexplored space in which the more curious deckbuilders, brewers and fine-tuners can (and eventually always will) explore. Commander in all its power levels provides players with nearly infinite possibilities in deckbuilding and self-expression; the possibilities for cEDH, while more finite, are vast and still have space for exploration. Even now. Especially now.
Remember, if the format was solved, none of us would be here asking questions, giving or taking criticism, writing posts or primers, and creating content pretty much every day with this very format in mind. We love Commander for what it is, and we will continue to keep playing the format that we set out to.
For every Magic format, be it a casual or a competitive one, there is the Timmy, there is the Johnny, and there is the Spike. And even if a new format were to split into a separate banlist, this community is and will be that Spike that plays Commander.
-The Competitive EDH Mod Team
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My second article is now live. A deep dive into Modern Goblins, magic theory, and what the future of competitive Goblins could look like in the world of Goblin Ringleader. If you enjoyed it, drop a comment and share it around. Thanks! https://mtgtheor…
This is my second entry into magic theory and how it applies to Modern Goblins! If you enjoyed it, leave a comment and share it around. Thanks! https://mtgtheories.home.blog/2019/06/28/modern-goblins-part-two-what-drives-the-pile/ submitted by …
submitted by /u/DragoonHeart to r/Pauper [link] [comments]
I hope you enjoyed Modern Horizons; we got some excellent upgrades.
Here are some of my general notes and my updates to my paper decks.
Force of Negation: Very nice. Not for every deck, but it’s awesome that we’re getting flexible options we can tailor builds with.
Canopy Lands & Talismans: These are just fantastic. I think there should be a little reservation about the life payment on the Canopies in a heavily life-oriented deck.
Mox Tantalite: Just not good enough. Terrible topdeck. Compares unfavorably to Search for Tomorrow (which already sees no play).
Yawgmoth: Probably not strong enough as a commander to sit with the big dogs. NASTY in Hapatra’s 99.
Plague Engineer: Very narrow. As a stretch, it could name Elf or Human in an extremely inbred meta.
Yuriko: Yuriko got some NICE buffs that give her a lot of extra reach. Changeling Outcast, Faerie Seer, Ingenious Infiltrator, Mist-Syndicate Naga, Fallen Shinobi
Echo of Eons: There’s a lot of hype about this card, but I feel strongly that this card isn’t good enough for full power cEDH, and it’s not an optimal budget substitution. Wheels either need to be played early (you can’t), have mana left over (you won’t), or be played into a payoff (too big of a mana barrier). If your plan A is attempting to Entomb it or loot it away, that’s too clunky of a plan. There are much better cards to do Timetwister-style loops with such as Memory’s Journey or Time Spiral + Narset’s Reversal.
Spice without an obvious home: Hogaak (in the 98/99), Cabal Therapist, Rain of Revelation, Archmage’s Charm
Red & White Forces: Come on. 🙁
Pretty massive upgrade to the deck. Added a land, as games are going a little later. I don’t think we want Canopy lands here, as with all the life we pay it’s going to be a net loss to cards seen to pay life each turn. I’ll test them and add them to the stock online list if they stay. I’m keeping Vexing Shusher from the Niv build — it’s a house.
- Add: The First Sliver, LabJace, Timetwister (budget: Goblin Bombardment), Riftsweeper, Extract, Morphic Pool
- Cut: Niv-Mizzet Reborn, Sparkcaster, Hydroid Krasis, Circu, Fire Covenant, Sterling Grove
- Considered: Force of Negation, Nurturing Peatland, Waterlogged Grove
Collector Ouphe is a fantastic addition. Force of Vigor also has a lot of potential. Ravenous Slime really wasn’t pulling its weight, and I’d been eyeing Azusa for cuts for a while.
- Add: Collector Ouphe, Force of Vigor, Prismatic Vista
- Cut: Ravenous Slime, Azusa, Snow-Covered Forest
- Considered: Savage Swipe
Talisman is a little stronger in the early game than Signet, and Signet is better on Engine lines; both are nearly equivalent in power. Canopy lands are good here, we ramp a lot (meaning we can avoid tapping it in a lot of scenarios) and don’t mind going late (so turning our lands into gas later is decent). Thrasios mirrors especially tend to be fairly standoffish and go late — we’d rather have advantage from Rhystic Study than watch our Spell Pierce scale off.
- Add: Talisman of Curiosity, Nurturing Peatland, Waterlogged Grove, Rhystic Study
- Cut: Simic Signet, Gemstone Mine, Yavimaya Coast, Spell Pierce
- Considered: Force of Negation, Tribute Mage
Turns out LabJace is the truth. Narset’s Reversal is a little reactive for what we’re trying to accomplish here. Talisman is an upgrade to Signet.
- Add: Talisman of Creativity, Fiery Islet, LabJace
- Cut: Azorius Signet, Urborg, Narset’s Reversal
- Considered: Force of Negation
- Add: Nurturing Peatland
- Cut: Scrubland
- Considered: Force of Vigor
Cutting RG lands for UR and UG Canopies!
- Add: Waterlogged Grove, Fiery Islet
- Cut: Grove of the Burnwillows, Spire Garden
Pondering Mage(jk never lucky)
Newly added to my roster! 🙂
Playing Time Spiral over Sleight of Hand and doing my darndest to figure out how to cut Voltaic Key.
- Add: Force of Negation, Prismatic Vista
- Considered: Mirrodin Beseiged, Tribute Mage
My JVP list is morphing into Urza for the time being. I can only be without High Tide for so long, so we’ll see shortly.
- Add: Force of Negation, Prismatic Vista
- Cut: Serum Visions, Snow-Covered Island
- Considered: Echo of Eons (we actually can loot it here! I still ultimately think it’s too clunky)